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cpm s45vn vs s30v

S35VN – 1975°F. S30V, S35VN, and now S45VN. I wrote about the history of 154CM in this article. Crucible's goal was to create an even tougher steel that didn't sacrifice resistance to corrosion, and they did that by using niobium carbides in place of some of S30V's vanadium … 5 out of 5 stars (1) 1 product ratings - Spyderco Jerry Brouwer CPM-S30V Green G-10 (Newest CQI Version) C232GTIP. However, its corrosion resistance was not the very best hence the advancement to S35VN. "CPM S35VN is a martensitic stainless steel designed to offer improved toughness over CPM S30V. S30V and S35VN are very similar for corrosion resistance. Advantages: Toughness, wear resistance, corrosion resistance. You can read more about what nitrogen additions do in this article on nitrogen additions as well as this article on S45VN. S30V – 2000°F. The addition of niobium is reflected with the addition of N in the name which is absent in the S30V. Enter your email address to subscribe to this blog and receive notifications of new posts by email. I won’t say equivalent but close, CPM 154 is close to the S30V in the balance between hardness, corrosion resistance, wear resistance, and toughness, but still the S30V is better in edge retention and corrosion resistance, the second equivalent for our CPM154 would be the 154 CM(since it was developed based on it), and of course CPM … The steel was designed to offer good wear and corrosion resistance as well as increased toughness in knives. Good heat treating response was achieved allowing heat treatment to be performed in a range of different furnaces. So even as S30V is replaced to some extent, it is often by steels that owe some of their design to the older S30V. Time will tell for sure, as I have not made more than a couple of hundred blades, but things are trending that way. 5% S30V. CPM s90v Corrosion Resistance: Great Corrosion Resistance due to … Improving all of those properties at the same time is difficult but I’m sure it helped that S30V is produced by powder metallurgy. Become a patron and gain access to awesome rewards including early access to articles or a Knife Steel Nerds mug! Vanadium carbides are classified as the hardest carbides, hence the incorporation of V in the name of the metals. [3] “Powder metallurgy tool steel article.” British patent 1443900, issued July 28, 1976. S30V also has a nitrogen addition [3], a point not often recognized since the nitrogen is not listed in the … However, in testing of that steel Chris Reeve Knives wanted more wear resistance to better differentiate from BG42, leading to an increase in vanadium up to the final 4%. With a low Cr (5%) steel like 10V, basically all of the vanadium forms the very hard vanadium carbides (VC) which contribute to wear resistance and edge retention. Freeman mentioned, “Not a knock on any other CPM steels, but so far this seems "cleaner", meaning that it gives a very uniform surface appearance across a large surface area. You can read more about carbide types and how elements interact to lead to different amounts in this article on carbides. ATS34 might need to be touched up a bit more often, but S30V will be a little harder to sharpen. Summary and Conclusions. In choosing the best pocket knife you should pay particular attention to the type of steel used in the blade. There weren’t obvious differences in the microstructure of SPY27 between 2000 and 2050°F, however. Crucible also famously developed powder metallurgy steels which started commercial-scale production in 1970. With poor grindability and little stain resistance it has never been used much outside of individual custom knives. Hey guys.. do you have a list of blade steels in order of edge retainability.. 440C 2.5 ft. lbs. Modifications of S30V led to the development of the also popular S35VN, and the more recent S45VN. The S35VN or CPM S35V is a high-end martensitic stainless steel made by @Crucible, high in Carbon, Vanadium, and chromium designed to offer a great balance between toughness, hardness and corrosion resistance.It’s used in long-wearing Specialty cutlery, Plastic Injection and Extrusion Feed Screws and Dies, … Further fast-quench and cold treatment are recommended at 400°F temperatures depending on the desired levels of hardness. $269.95. The chemistry has been rebalanced to improve corrison resistance, wear resistance and edge retention. Its composition has been altered to create more chromium carbides, while also allowing free chromium compounds in the composition. Add in the machined "grooves" on the bevels, and the edge thickness can be .050" prior to sharpening. Required fields are marked *. It's about the same edge retention as S30V but with better toughness and corrosion resistance. Yojimbo™ 2 Carbon Fiber CPM 20CV Exclusive. Corrosion resistance is “above average” and has been sufficient for many knives that have been released over the almost 20 years S30V has been available. According to the specs, toughness is slightly decreased, CPM S45VN has 11lbs on C notch, vs. 12lbs on S35vn steel, but better than 10lbs on earlier S30v steel. See this article to learn about corrosion resistance. The corrosion resistance of S30V and the similar S35VN have been found to be better than CPM-154, in a range I would call “above average.” The corrosion resistance has been improved somewhat with the new S45VN, but S30V is good enough for many knives. People were calling it, “the best knife steel … This is why 3% vanadium 3V has much better toughness and grindability than the 10% vanadium 10V, though at the cost of wear resistance. With this in mind, the chemical composition used in the manufacture of S35VN was rebalanced with the addition of chromium for an improvement in corrosion resistance coming up with a new product: S45VN. If you’re also a steel nerd like myself, you know the advantages and disadvantages of S30V, which has long been an industry standard and still continues to be. [1] http://www.seamountknifeworks.com/js/web/viewer.html?file=articles/pdf/S30V_update.pdf. Be first to receive news about sales, coupons & new promotions. S90V has a better edge retention but let's all be honest, edge retention for most of us is just numbers on a piece of paper. A low combination of very hard carbides can give a better balance of properties compared to a larger volume of softer carbides. Will work and grind like D2 and give the hardness and toughness of CPM S30V. "Corrosion Resistance S35VN, which is the mainstream steel, contains lower components of niobium and lacks nitrogen, which is added to S45VN to increase toughness. Niobium carbides are also hard hence used in place of vanadium to form higher wear resistance. Vanadium carbides also tend to be smaller (read this article) so having less chromium carbide means better toughness as well. Steel is essentially an alloy (i.e. ""For edge toughness, I haven't been able to discern any difference but that is likely more due to my edge geometry and processes. The Cr was reduced for a different reason, however. Possibly due to a 2,000F AUS temperature that gives a higher hardness, among other things. Crucible Industries has been producing steel with high wear resistance, corrosion resistance, and toughness by adding vanadium and niobium when creating new products. It is also easier to machine and polish than CPM S30V. Personally, excitement over the release of S30V in 2001 was part of what led me to become a metallurgist and to eventually research and write for this website. Below is a table summarizing the resulting properties including the amount of chromium carbide (M7C3), vanadium carbide (MC), measured toughness (higher is better) wear resistance in a crossed-cylinder wear test (higher is better), and corrosion measured in a 10% boiling acetic acid solution (lower is better): So with all of those lessons learned, it was known that a lower chromium content would allow vanadium to go further in terms of its contribution to wear resistance. This difference can be felt when whittling and cutting fibrous materials like cardboard and ropes despite the lack of change in heat treatment, the S45VN has a hardness rating of 61-62 compared to 59-60 of the S35VN. And molybdenum and nitrogen additions were used to balance the corrosion resistance along with edge retention and toughness. As described in the S45VN article, nitrogen also decreases the chromium carbide content while increasing the vanadium carbide content, though I’m not sure that was recognized at the time that S30V was designed. ?? Metallurgy and Testing of Knives and Steel. So I think that 20CV would probably be the best choice for Spyderco to use if production costs were competitive with S30V or S45VN. What it is: CPM S35VN is a "Crucible Particle Metallurgy" stainless steel, an improvement over CPM S30V, and is widely regarded as a "super steel" for its properties and performance. S60V, however, was essentially 440C but with 5.5% vanadium added and enough carbon to maintain similar hardness potential. And less chromium carbide means that even though S90V has less chromium, less is tied up in carbides so that the chromium is free in the steel to improve corrosion resistance. Knifemaker Jeff Freeman of Freeman Outdoor Gear remarked, “Edge retention appears to be very similar or maybe just slightly better than S30V and S35VN. Which makes it probably not the best "slicer" with .156" stock and a 5-degree bevel, but it sure makes a good and tough utility edge that maintains sharpness in use across a wide variety of cutting media.S45VN steel seems to provide a good canvas to for surface finishes. S30V continues to be the benchmark other stainless knife steels are compared to. Another fact known is that a reduced carbon and vanadium content would lead to a steel that was tougher and easier to grind because of a reduction in overall carbide content. Eventually though, CRK introduced S30V steel, which Chris was directly involved … But it does appear that I'm getting a little bit better life out of my cutting tools. For the maker, it appears to result in longer tool life and possibly increased speeds and feeds with the accompanying decrease in cycle time and machine time. [2] Haswell, Walter T., and August Kasak. The goal was to design a steel which was superior to BG42 in terms of toughness, edge retention, and corrosion resistance. S35VN was released in 2009 as a modification of S30V to have superior toughness and … I really would like to try out SPY-27, that looks like an interesting steel also. S30V was designed to offer a “balanced” stainless steel which could offer good grindability, toughness, corrosion resistance, and edge retention. The replacement of vanadium and carbon with niobium and nitrogen produces an excellent combination of wear and corrosion resistance, edge retention, and toughness making this the ideal choice in the manufacture of knives. While various manufacturers have already put out the S45VN knife in the markets, it is bound to be more resistant to corrosion and wear as well have tough on edge retention. 21 (1983): 53. The carbide structure of S30V was finer than the common 154CM (BG42 is similar) because of powder metallurgy. SPY27 – 2050°F. In 1970, Crucible Industries pioneered in the production of powder metallurgy tool steels. With increased carbon content and less vanadium, S45VN holds an edge longer as compared to its predecessors. Thanks to Atlas Knife & Tool and Mervin Thomson for become Knife Steel Nerds Patreon supporters! Notify me of follow-up comments by email. So we can understand more the Steel, let’s see its chemical … Other possible uses include the manufacture of industrial machinery include: pelletizing equipment, extrusion feed screws, non-return valve components, components for food and chemical processing.Download the Crudible CPM S45VN Steel Datasheet, CPM vs Conventionally Produced Steel (Source Crucible Industries Datasheet), CPM S45VN Alloy Composition (Source Crucible Industries Datasheet), Functional Comparison of S45VN vs other Knife Steels (Source Crucible Industries Datasheet). In the development of S90V, the Cr was reduced relative to S60V, dropping from 17% to 14% similar to the modification of 440C to make 154CM. It's good stuff and I have, make and use S30V blades and haven't had big problems with chipping, but I don't chop cinder blocks either. I also get good corrosion resistance. The increase in Mo from 1% in S90V up to 2% in S30V provided an increase in corrosion resistance with the relatively low 14% Cr. Both S30V and S35VN steel are made with the same carbon and chrome content, and from various tests, both steels provide the same edge retention and corrosion … The edge retention is … It also has increased Carbon and a some Nitrogen added to allow for higher hardness than CPM S35VN. 154CM was designed for bearings, and was essentially a modification of 440C by reducing the chromium (Cr) by ~3% and adding 4% molybdenum (Mo). 4% S90V. $217.95. Nitrogen was added in place of carbon and niobium increased in place of vanadium to improve corrosion resistance present in S35NV.Edge Retention Your vote has been cast. Yojimbo™ 2 G-10 Brown Black Blade CPM S90V Exclusive. 10V, developed in the 1970s [2][3], had very high wear resistance with good toughness but was not stainless. Freeman also said that “I think the main advantage of S45VN is the increased corrosion resistance. Seems to be slightly worse at everything, from toughness, wear resistance, to edge retention and corrosion resistance. Powder metallurgy allowed higher alloy steels and finer microstructures because of the rapid solidification process. And thanks to Dick Barber for talking to me about the development of S30V. The edge retention of S30V is still pretty good relative to other knife steels, better than steels like XHP, Elmax, 154CM, 440C, etc. With my own CATRA experiments the relative position of S30V is approximately the same, but I will be talking about those experiments in a future article. As shown in the datasheet, S30V can reach at least 64 Rc when using cold treatments, and can easily be tempered down to the 58-61 Rc range common for many knives. S35VN, which was introduced in 2009 uses the modified formula of S30V, which is made with 1.45% carbon, 4% vanadium, and 10.5% chromium carbide with the addition of niobium to the vanadium and chromium carbide forming elements. Design of S45VN Steel – Nitrogen. There are three significant things to know about S45VN steel: it has high vanadium content for very tough carbides (edge retention), it has high chromium for increased corrosion resistance, and niobium content for a cleaner grind/machinability.In late 2019, Crucible industries in collaboration with Niagra Speciality Metals debuted CPM S45VN. CPM S45VN is the updated version of CPM-S35VN. Top. This resulted in a similar amount of carbide, but much more of it is vanadium carbide, which results in higher wear resistance. Custom knifemaker Jeff Freeman mentioned, that machining and cutting S45VN steel for blades, "For processing, I use the same tools (solid carbide) with the same coolant and fixturing. S60V was the first CPM steel produced by the company through the modification of common stainless grade 440C steel by increasing the composition of vanadium with a corresponding increase of carbon elements.Knifemaker Jeff Freeman of Freeman Outdoor Gear mentioned that, "I think CPM S45VN is a good improvement, both for the maker and the end-user. If it costs the same as S30V/S35VN I could see a use for it, if its 10-20% more expensive, than we're in the price range of 20CV/M390. [4] Chilton’s iron age 226, no. On future batches, I will try and up the speeds and feeds and possibly depths of cut to see if I can decrease cycle times and maintain cutting tool life and dimensional precision/repeatability. CPM-20CV. Re: S35VN vs. S30V Post by glbpro » Sat May 23, 2015 1:17 pm I recently purchased a native 5 lightweight to try out both the native as well as the CPM S35VN, a steel which I had no previous experience with. The resulting edge retention is better than steels like Elmax, S35VN, CPM-154, and BG42, though a bit worse than S90V and M390. Yojimbo™ 2 Natural G-10 CPM M4 Exclusive. Steels have varying levels of difficulty working the steel, can require specialized tools and exacting heat treatment.S45VN fits the bill for high-end knifemakers that require excellent edge retention and corrosion resistance that is relatively easy to work. This is in reference to surface grinding water jet cut blanks to final thickness. Yojimbo™ 2 Natural G-10 CPM® M4 Black Blade Exclusive. That conversation led to Dick, along with Ed Severson, conducting interviews with many knifemakers and knife companies about the properties they desired in a knife steel. So what they did in the development of S90V was reduce the chromium content by 3% and add a corresponding amount of vanadium while maintaining a similar carbon content. S45VN uses a similar chemical formula but with a rebalance of the percentage compositions of the elements. Chromium and vanadium both compete to form carbides. I am liking S30V more that 154CM, VG-10, and D2 because when I go to lower angles when sharpening I don’t get the micro-chipping with S30V. 154CM 2.5 ft. lbs. CPM SPY27 is a steel produced by Crucible exclusively for Spyderco. The lead development metallurgist was Dick Barber who used the history of stainless steels developed by Crucible to inform the designs that were tried, including important details like the amount of chromium used, how much vanadium to achieve the right balance of properties. Softer chromium carbides do not contribute as much to wear resistance but they detract just as much (or more) from toughness as vanadium carbides do. The toughness of S30V is similar to other stainless steels in its class according to my own toughness experiments, though not record-setting, as seen in our standard toughness test utilizing unnotched 1/4 size charpy specimens: However, I think the toughness of S30V could be further improved with better heat treating, if we use what we learned with heat treating S35VN, S45VN, and SPY27. “Powder-metallurgy steel article with high vanadium-carbide content.” U.S. Patent 4,249,945, issued February 10, 1981. Therefore, having only vanadium carbides means a better wear resistance-toughness balance. vivi Member … Extreme edge retention. ... Spyderco Para 3 Sprint Run-Diamond Arc Text Forest Green G-10-CPM-S45VN. It gives a nice sharp bright and mirror-polished finish on the edge. $329.95. Alongside edge geometry and design, blade steel is a critical element that determines how a knife performs. S30V also needed to be easily heat treated with common knife heat treating equipment which was why Paul Bos was consulted. Carbides are hard particles in steel that add to wear resistance but detract from toughness. In late 2019, Crucible industries in collaboration with Niagra Speciality Metals debuted CPM S45VN. It was designed in conjunction with knife companies, knifemakers, and heat treaters to learn the properties that they wanted in a knife steel. Impact Energy Crucible developed several powder metallurgy steels including 10V, S60V (formerly 440V) and S90V (formerly 420V), but none of them really gained wide use in knives. The chromium also forms some softer chromium carbides but they are dissolved at typical heat treating temperatures. It also has better toughness than S30V, S45VN, and Elmax. $104.95. It is a step forward from S35VN but its improvements are incremental better not orders of magnitude better. Apart from the increase in Cr, S45VN also has a 0.15% nitrogen addition. S30V is, in many eyes, the ultimate EDC steel. Chris Reeve is famous for developing two steels directly with Crucible Industries, and boy did this partnership result in an awesome product. S45VN D2 440C 154CM S30V S35VN S90V s Corrosion Resistance Toughness Wear Resistance Grade CPM S45VN 11.0 ft. lbs. According to the chemical composition and the HRC of the steel, the CPM s90v Steel has the following features: CPM s90v Edge Retention: With a high presence of vanadium and carbon, s90v steel offers extreme edge retention (might be the best in the steel).

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